Hi everyone, I haven't posted in a while and hope everyone is doing ok. My parents finally moved near us, in fact, in our condo complex and are renting. I packed and unpacked every single box for them and was away from my husband during his chemo and radiation treatments for 2 months so they could move from Florida to Virginia. My husband was with me during my breast cancer journey and I feel awful that I couldn't be there for him. We actually felt their needs were more important, but we have sacrificed our lives for my parents since we were married and before (that's another story in itself!)
Now here's the problem - she is getting upset when I tell her I need to go downstairs to care for my ailing husband and to straighten up my home. She has my Dad who can care for her. I'm starting to resent them being here. I told her I would like to use my own bathroom and I want to put some things away and stay home a little bit. She made a face and asked me why and I said I'll be back later and she said you don't have to - stay down there (angrily). I'm starting to get my nervous stomach back and to be honest I yelled at her the other day. As many posters know, my mom has always been "needy". I will fill you in with details later on, but for now I need help! I am neglecting my husband, my dog and my own needs! Thank you my wonderful friends!
But when a Italian woman marries, she goes to live with her husband's family in the multigenerational home. No exceptions. And si, Romeo, sharing family meals is a serious thing . No introverted personality behavior seen at the family table, though- you must be animated, extroverted, opinionated, articulate, educated, and celebrate the meal. Lots of happy arguing and witty humor about topics, lots of good natured laughter. Good table manners are essential. No snarky behavior evident at the table. Children and teens are well behaved.
But it does explain my daughter’s future Italian American father in law . I thought he was just intense, but maybe that’s just normal for him . We’ve had dinner with my daughter’s future in laws quite a few times , it’s hard to get a word in . His wife ( she’s not Italian ) and I are both sort of quiet people but we try to have our own little seperate conversations , while our two husbands chit chat . My husband is a talker as well although he’s not Italian . Sometimes we wives look at each other and roll our eyes about how our two husbands go on non stop.
I don't do a lot at moms because I can't take the hovering and micro managing.
You matter.
And we are a support group to support you , not to support your parents.
I LIVED in Italy for three years (it was wonderful), and over and over again the Italians that I befriended talked frankly about how difficult it was/is to break away from family and cultural expectations. Children are EXPECTED to live in multigenerational homes with grandparents, parents, spouses, children, and often aunts/uncles and the younger family members are EXPECTED to care for the older ones in every way possible, until the elders die. And this expectation is not only for daughters, but for sons, too.
It's tougher on women who are typically paid less than their male peers. It's still a male dominated culture, for example, I was not allowed to sign the lease on our rental, only my husband was allowed to sign it. Women's efforts to rent places of their own are typically kissed off sweetly by real estate agents or landlords regardless of ability to pay the rent.. Inside the Italian home, Nonna is in charge and she rules the roost with a firm hand. Italy is all about the duty to maintain historic tradition regarding almost everything.
Ciao!
You said that your husband is ill. He really should be your #1 priority, not your parents. I just hope he's really ok with it and (hopefully) not resenting you.
You said you have no friends anymore as you didn't have the time or energy to invest in them. I understand that. I also believe this venue is your avenue to vent to someone, anyone, about your life who might understand it. It's always good to have a place to vent. I also see you're using HUMOR, which is very good. It is the key to not letting the people in our lives, who are trying their best to manipulate us, upset us.
Just remember, you have to take care of yourself first or you won't be any good helping anyone else. And if you have to get into Therapy to learn how, do it.
Do you even know how you are??
I don't give a rats butt about your parents actually at this point.
This is about YOU.
How are you?
Without, I'm good butt moms mad at me, honest to God. Who cares.
Can you finish a complete sentence about you, without talking about your parents.
Do you ever say, to your husband, we need to get coffee at the store today, with out think.
Mom needs ,B, C, and D and then you need coffee.
Are you getting the point I'm trying to get out there??
I'm going to walk Romeo and I'm completely exhausted from their antics telling me stop yelling while I explain things, blah, blah, blah. I could give a crap about anything right now.
Like I said, I think part of why you and hubs are so into helping them is so you won’t dwell on the worst cases of your own physical situations. But that doesn’t mean denying them at your peril.
Cancer has not definitively let go of eith one of you yet. And if either of you have to go on for round 2 of chemo, it’s not going to be as easy as the first. If you’re both sick, then you’re going to have to get in at minimum 12/24 hour care for the two of you. Which could be near 100k a year, and we are talking the care.com or Nextdoor rate. An agency will be double.
If you yourselves are renting an apartment, I seriously doubt you can afford to take on another households bills.
She's also asking me what am I doing in my apartment - I told her everything that I neglected when I spent 2 months in Florida and 1 month here unpacking. She just can't understand that I have a household to run and even if I just wanted to read or write or go on the computer - for heavens sake - anything else I want to do. What is her business? This is beyond ridiculous that it's becoming funny. Last night while she was sitting down she was directing where she wanted to fix her other chairs. I said - Mom I really really want to go home and I bowed to her - like yes mam, I'm at your beck and call - being sarcastic. She's a character!
Is she really kidding me?
This is the story.
*Separation anxiety*
Romeo, maybe google those & see if it fits with Mom's clingy behaviour.
"She just has to let me go home to sit in my own living room!"
Do you see that you cannot wait for Mom to 'let you', for Mom to give you permission?
Do you see how you made a stand. Pushed back. Stated no, you were going home. You then did so.
Well done there.
I think the wider picture will include assessing your folks' real needs vs their wants & whims. These can come at you All.Day.Long. 100s of small issues - which will eat you up.
Especially if there is clingyness.
Romeo is up against a hard place knowing that her parents likely will pass within three years. They are 93 and 96 after all. Her rock is her husband, who could feasibly pass within three years. Same for her if her breast cancer has metasized to her lung.
When one is up against a rock and a hard place, one needs to choose between two non ideal options. Well, Romeo, given the nonzero odds of you or him needing another round of chemo that could trigger y’all into getting aides for yourself, you and he need to enjoy each passing day together as it is among your last as it very well be.
I am thinking that Romeo and her husband focus on being rescuers to avoid looking at the blunt bottom line of their own physical conditions. And maybe it’s a cope in that they’re not dwelling on themselves.
Maybe AL when the lease is up on the condo , hopefully it’s not longer than a year lease .
In the meantime Romeo , try to set some boundaries as far as time away from your parents , and remember you don’t have to give them everything they WANT, just what they NEED.
You can choose to play your mother's game and accept the guilt or ... not. Once you choose to not accept the guilt then you will start feeling better about the situation.
Were your parents planning/willing to live in AL ?
If so , that’s where they should be .
If you stopped them from moving to AL , you are totally enmeshed and are addicted to this drama.
Dawn - I really should have kept my mouth shut! They were going into an assisted living facility right down the street and my heart felt bad that they would be living in a very small apartment and thought they weren't ready for it. My Dad called EMS the other day and was hospitalized for a kidney stone. The AL would have taken care of everything, and taken care of my mom and her dog and now we are. How stupid am I! They are ready for it because my Dad crossed into three lanes of traffic in Florida with cars bearing down on us and I was SCREAMING and had to tell him to go ahead and he yelled at me saying - they were going to stop for me. I was really stupid! My husband also co-signed for their lease and now we're stuck - all because we don't want them to be upset.
The fact of the matter is, you don't want "help". You like this "close knit" family situation just fine, as you said, there's nothing wrong with it. What is it you seek? Validation for being a good daughter? I grew up in the exact type of household you describe. Dysfunctional. Expected to be the entertainment committee for my personality disordered mother and to be her BFF too, in spite of the fact she was an insufferable human being. Of COURSE they're "controlling".....how else are they going to manipulate a daughter into taking care of them for 60 years, visiting with them all day long, cooking for them, traveling with them, taking them to get their nails done, bringing them popsicles, etc? Very, very few daughters actually want to do that or consider it a normal thing, outside of Italy. I certainly DID NOT want to lead my life that way!!
As a young child, my only goal was to escape the suffocation I suffered, not to endure it until they died. So I did, until I had my son. Then my parents followed me all over the country to "help me" with the baby. I finally moved back East to get out of that nightmare, and had my own life again for 17 years.
You, on the other hand, enjoy the company of your parents. Otherwise you would have allowed them to move into AL as planned. As I did with my folks.....
There is no crime in what you are doing. The silliness is in trying to make us think you hate it and want it to change. At 64 years old when your parents are approaching the end of their lives. If anything, you will be doing MORE for them NOW than ever before and likely cohabitating at some point.
So stop asking for advice and just live your life as YOU SEE FIT. You've gotten years worth of great advice here on A.C. you've totally ignored. Nothing is changing now and we all know it, you included.
Good luck, I'm out.
"There is no crime in what you are doing. The silliness is in trying to make us think you hate it and want it to change."
You also ask: "What is the purpose of this thread".
BINGO.
This thread, like most social media. is just chit chat. It will go on longer than "Is it Wrong to Hope Someone Dies" (now over 900 responses). This is a family in which all participants are fully engaged, and the last thing any of them want is "help". That would mean "change". And no one here wants change. They are perfectly happy with status quo.
Thanks, Lea, for saying here what I have longed to say every time I trip over this one at the top of the threads, and saying it so much better than I ever could.
My dh’s favorite cousin passed away from tongue and throat cancer on Christmas Eve 2018. She had undergone surgery, chemo and rads. She was 45 and had been in remission for some months before it came roaring back. Her husband was present for that whole journey as versus offering his mom manicures and popsicles and dinners without the sick person and dog walking trips.
Your parents had 30 years after the age of 64 to enjoy their retirement with themselves. It is a nonzero possibility that you may not have three, and if it is, will you be happy that you spent that time on moms manicure and her insistence that you cook her fresh Italian dinners?
Just cause they are family doesn’t mean you have to . I really hate that people think you have to put up with bad behavior because someone is family .
Stands to reason why I don’t see my narc sibs who learned from my narcissist mother .
Romeo .
Your mother is manipulative , passive aggressive, not just dramatic.
She is not in control of your life. YOU ARE.
Forgive me is I speak plainly and what I'm saying is for your own good.
Your husband is a very sick man. Shame on you for letting mommy's narcissism and guilt-tripping come before him. That stops today.
Too damn bad if your mother wants you with her instead. Boo-hoo. Let her pout and cry about it. Let her behave like a senior-brat or an elder-tyrant because she doesn't get her own way. Let her man sort her out. It's his job to, not yours.
Think about this. You moved your parents NEAR you. Not in WITH you. Is this because you're smart and knew how your mother would be and wanted to be able to close your own door?
Close it then. It's okay. Set some boundaries and if your mother is unwilling to live by them, start ignoring her. Don't go to her place and don't take her calls for a while.
Your husband and your life come before your mother's neediness.
What is the longest you went without seeing your parents? I suspect this dynamic of you visiting them for months at a time (when they were in FL) or them visiting you for months at a time has been going on for a very long time - if not for your entire life.
That is why you are unable to separate yourself from them - you are like conjoined twins. Neither you or your parents (mom more so than dad) can function or be apart for very long since it is all you know.
And now as they are getting older and more needy this dynamic is just rapidly escalating (especially for your mother) as she wants you there 24/7. You can bet your dad has to hear it from mom ALL the time when you don't do what she wants.
instead of running upstairs all the time to “ check on them “ what if you put a camera in their condo ?
But don’t stare at it constantly .
At present the older two are in a separate nearby condo, within the same building. The older housemates are already too anxious to be alone. They will soon move into the same condo. Then when walking becomes difficult, into the living room into electric beds.
I don't see any other pathway here.
So at least I hope it will be a loving & fun household. Like the Golden Girls sitcom.
Your parents are pretty old and I fear you are too conditioned and emeshed to make the changes needed to be fully autonomous from your parents.
But any small steps you make are better than doing nothing at this point.
I wonder how you got them to agree to move to VA because last year when you posted you said they loved FL and would never move. Did they decide to move closer to you because you started visiting less?