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Her son passed away 4 yrs ago. My son-in-law is her only grandchild. she does have a nephew who lives my. It is his wife that is the POA. So it is a family member. Dealing with my own situation when lost my mother in June my sister was the POA and she kept my brother and myself informed about everything, and if a questioned was asked she always was quick to respond with an answer. That is way I am so concerned on the lack of communication from the POA. She acts like it is only her and her husband's business when it comes to my son-in-law's grandmother. Yes getting old is very complicated, and if you don't have everything in order, and also have more than one person in to for checks and balances there can be alot of funny business going on. Money makes people do funny things. I hope nothing is gong on, but it needs to be checked into.
So this is your son-in-law's grandmother. Is he the only living heir? Are her children deceased? The POA can be a bum off the street if the grandmother trusts them. But as her grandson, he has the right to know how money is being spent. Talk to a lawyer now, I would bet grandma is being taken advantage of. What kind of person can do this. I am so amazed at the things I read on this site. Children who take their parents money, parents who hurt their children over money, children who won't help, horrible parents who cause the children not to help. Getting old certainly can be complicated.
Thank you all for your information and comments. I will keep you posted on what happens with my son-in-law's grandmother. Thanks again.....it is nice to know that when a person needs help there is someplace you can go for information and support.
Iowa, Speaking in terms of POA, if they are making the sound decision and there is not another (Secondary Person) listed on the POA to over-ride their decisions, basically you would have to pursue the matter legally if you and other family members do not feel they are holding up to their responsibility.
As for the Care facility, have you contacted them personally just to get information as to how much they charge, what they offer? If you have not, first and foremost, you want to look into this yourself...I am hoping this is the same place you are speaking of, as I am attaching their website: http://www.iowahealthhomecare.org/body.cfm?id=42
My Aunt is 94 and living in an assisted living home, paying 1,000 a month, however, this facility she is at, DOES NOT, have all of the care that the Taylor House offers for care.
Investigate her needs, rather your parents and other Aunts/Uncles will need to do this, as they are her children. We grandchildren, unless caring for them personally, really have NO SAY in the situation at hand unless you have the backbone to stand up for your grandmother =] I wish you all the best, and hope this helped a little.
I'd like to share a web site that I created concerning the subject because of my very dep concern about this type of elder abuse. It is www.annaburbage.org . She was abused and my mother who is suffering from dementia has been as well. Abusers don't stop unless they are confronted. But other than attempting to deal with the abuser or suspected abuser or the authorities, you must not risk taking specifics out in public. Yet, how can the public realize that issues as discussed here are happening and are likely wrongful.
the people that care for her, what are they doing but draining the family and you beleive this is love, 6,ooo a week the aides that feed her, care for her . do not make this amount in three months . i wwould take her home an show her love talk about things, laugh, i was taking care of a 92 year old lady. she spent most of her awaking hrs, asking was i there yet, we drove a round to the beach, i let her feet get wet, we ate what ever she wanted the doctor had told her family and my self that she would pass in 6 months , she lived 8 more years, i was blessed to have known her, her last days was spent in a nuring home, that where she passed, the family was busy, i cried like a baby, and i was only her caregiver i received more joy from being with her than anyone i can think of . think about this. wjohnso
I fell bad for you because you are dealing with a thief and a liar. Please do like Ed said and don't wait. Family confrontations are always awful, money makes people nuts and morphine over an extended period of time with anybody, but especially the elderly, will turn them into a shadow of themselves which is what the thief and liar want. This is ugly and you can fix it, but like many have said, you're going to need a lawyer and pronto. Call the state's Attorney General. They take a dim view of any abuse of the elderly, physical, emotional or financial. Good luck and keep us posted. What low lifes.
The way it works in our state, when my mom entered the "health care", 90 days are allowed on Medicare, then if she's going to stay all assets are signed over to the place that will be taking care of her. The cost is based on her income and how much money she has including car, life ins, bonds, etc. Medicaid gets all and turns around and pays the place she'll be staying. This is in Ks.
Which state is your grandma? I live in Wa state. I am i Residential Care provider. I do not admit Residents in hospice but, if they go into hospice during their stay, the charge is way less than what your grandma is paying. Depends on the level of care can be about $6,000-$7,000/mo. Or, maybe you miss understood like Madge said. Gets very expensive because are nurses, social worker involved also, 2 caregivers, 24/7 care, if she is bed bound, she needs to be turn every 2hrs, maybe feeding, etc.
Tell the grandson to report the POA and that lounge lizard husband of hers to the authorities before it's too late and the $ is all gone ... and grandma has to move in with him. Hurry.
The reason she is on morphine is because she fell and broke 4 ribs. Her son passed from cancer 4 yrs ago and she only has one grandson. She chose this person because she was a nurse and felt that she would have the knowledge that is needed in handling her affairs. The reason that her grandson is concerned is because the POA gets very defensive when he tries to ask questions about his grandmother. He also is concerned because when the grandmother asked the POA about her finances the POA became very angry with the grandmother. His grandmother told his wife that she felt that she should be able to ask about her own money, but she didn't want to push the issue because she did not want to make the POA mad. The POA had all of the mail forwarded to her home and only brought over cards that were send to the grandmother (and they were already opened by the POA). The grandson found two bank statements that were sent to the grandmother (before the mail was forwarded) and before the POA was in of charge of her affairs that had large amounts in each accounts. His grandmother had no debts and spent very little money. Since the POA has been in charge of her financial affairs the POA has canceled her BlueCross insurance (which the grandson doesn't believe the grandmother knows about) and the house insurance. Now the POA has indicated to the grandson that his grandmother has very little money left and she may have to leave the Taylor House. This has sent up a red flag to the grandson because he has seen the POA and her husband make large purchases on high ticket items. The POA's husband only works 19hrs per week and the POA has a full time job that pays her an average salary. We hope that everything is fine but the grandson really need to know that his grandmother has not been take advantage of and wants her to have the best care for the rest of her life.
Using an alias, call Taylor House to ask about their weekly rates / charges. But stroke them a little with "I've heard you're the best; blah, blah, blah." Also, see if you can schedule a tour of the facilities -- or send someone instead -- to see what you'd actually be paying for. If possible, get it in print. Then confront the FPA about the $6K a week.
There's something fishy going on. And if not, your Mom better be living in the lap of luxury for that kind of money.
If your grandma is ok without morphine and she has not been dexlared incompetent, and she is satisfied with the in law she has appointed, then it may be her will. things get complex because if the appointment was made while under the influence of morphine, then at the time she would have been incompetent but proving is a challenge. Is there really a need for morphine? Such can be abused and actually can ensure incompetence. It is unusual to use for an extended period of time but for a terminal illness. I hope that you have extensive records to prove your case and that you have witnesses with actual personal knowledge. The in law may be doing what your grandma wants. Please understand that may not be what you think is right but what she desires. You will encounter road blocks in your attempts to resolve the matter and there will be dead ends. Does your grandma have other children, grandchildren, siblings that share your concerns? A group discussion with the POA might help. Regardless, there is strength in numbers.
Yes she was of sound mind before she fell. The problem is the POA is not only her financial POA, but her medical POA too. We had decided to try and find out who her attorney is and maybe contact the Dept of Social Services for the elderly. Thank you for all your information.
Morphine is only a medication, not an impairment in and of itself. If a person has not been declared not of sound mind, that person can freely exercise his/her will. However, if you feel that your grandma is really not of sound mind and in your heart you know that she is not 100%, it is only right that you petition the court or appropriate authority for conservatorship. Assuming that she does not suffer from any form of dementia, you can take her to a neurologist, gerontologist, psychiatrist or last resort a GP and get them to attest that she is ok and get a few witnesses as well declaring the same and if she wishes rescind the prior POA, and she can give it to someone else. Was the financiial POA appointed prior to morphine? Kinda sounds like your grandma may have appointed the current person to as in a Spring POA whereapon the need arises, the POA is activated. Wishing your grandma the best and for her wishes to be followed and respected
So this is a family member who is doing this? It will be difficult to get grandma to appoint a new POA. But whoever this is could deplete all of your grandmother's funds. I would get a lawyer, the POA has to account for their spending. This is such a red flag. Good Luck
she was in a good state of mine, but since her fall they have had her on morphine. When she is not on so much morphine she is able to understand what is going on. Like any older person they trust family members and don't believe that they would take advantage of them. Thank you for your support.
Good idea about an attorney. Is your grandma of sound mind? Or, put another way, has she ever been declared not mentally sound? If she has not, she can terminate the POA. And, if she is not sound, you can petition to take over or for someone else to do so. If sound, you don't necessarily need an attorney. Wishing you success.
I agree, and have contacted the Taylor House in Des Moines where our grandmother is staying. They told me what the rates are and they are no where near the $6,000.00 that we were told it costs. I have decided to contact an attorney to see if we can get financial information from her financial POA since she has been reluctant to give us this information in the past, and became upset with our grandmother when she asked questions about her own money.
I found a Taylor House in Iowa. Is this the one? I would call and ask them specifically about the cost. They might be reluctant to discuss specifics but you should be able to get a rough idea. $312,000 per year would be luxury. Perhaps there is some additional medical care involved which might increase the amount. I would be shocked if your grandma doesn't have Medicare which would help funding. If the cost is really $312,000/yr or $6000.00/wk I am in disbelief. It is the business to get into at that rate. Why not offer to take care of your grandma yourself especially if she is relatively ok? You could have 24 hr RN coverage and more for at that rate. Something doesn't sound quite right. There is no stigma associated with asking concerned questions.
There is no reason that you should not be able to find out the cost of your Grandmother living there. It was always public knowlege what a place would charge people to stay there at places that I worked at in North Carolina. So just go right ahead and ask questions.
Hi, your question has really bothered me so I did a little research, hospice can cost 6,000 a week if you have no insurance coverage. Does grandma have medicare or medicaid? That should cover the hospice, now the cost of the facility is a difference thing. Medicare won't cover that. This all bothers me because of the secrecy. I am dealing with alot of secrecy in my family and it only cases problems. If the POA is paying for hospice care with no insurance it could cost that much. But the facility is another cost. Good luck.
Just think, I live in a very expensive area of Florida. One of my neighbors has a wife in a nursing home here. It is 80K a year, above the national average. That is about 1,600 per week. That adds up to about 6,000.00 per month. Maybe the POA meant monthly, not weekiy. That would be more like it.
Who is her POA? All POA, if honest, will be open with family. Taylor House should at least give you an idea of the weekly cost. Where I live in Florida we have a beautiful hospice home, I don't know what it costs. I do know that most hospice is done at home through Medicare. Medicare pays for hospice care but not room and board in a nursing home. But even if she were in a nursing home, it shouldn't cost this much. I would be very suspicious.
Taylor House is for a person going into Hospice. Her Power of Attorney is telling us that it is this amount. Do we have the right to request a statement from the care center even though this person controls her health and finances? I just want to know that our grandmother is not being taken advantage of by this person.
Ask for an itemized bill. I don't know what Taylor house is but where I lived in Florida a very high end nursing home is 80K a year. So Taylor House sounds a little expensive to me. Make them show the bill.
By proceeding, I agree that I understand the following disclosures:
I. How We Work in Washington.
Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services.
APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
II. How We Are Paid.
We do not charge you any fee – we are paid by the Participating Communities. Some Participating Communities pay us a percentage of the first month's standard rate for the rent and care services you select. We invoice these fees after the senior moves in.
III. When We Tour.
APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
IV. No Obligation or Commitment.
You have no obligation to use or to continue to use our services. Because you pay no fee to us, you will never need to ask for a refund.
V. Complaints.
Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
VI. No Waiver of Your Rights.
APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.
I agree that:
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I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information").
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APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink.
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APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site.
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If I want a paper copy, I can print a copy of the Disclosures or download the Disclosures for my records.
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This E-Sign Acknowledgement and Authorization applies to these Disclosures and all future Disclosures related to APFM's services, unless I revoke my authorization. You may revoke this authorization in writing at any time (except where we have already disclosed information before receiving your revocation.) This authorization will expire after one year.
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You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
Speaking in terms of POA, if they are making the sound decision and there is not another (Secondary Person) listed on the POA to over-ride their decisions, basically you would have to pursue the matter legally if you and other family members do not feel they are holding up to their responsibility.
As for the Care facility, have you contacted them personally just to get information as to how much they charge, what they offer? If you have not, first and foremost, you want to look into this yourself...I am hoping this is the same place you are speaking of, as I am attaching their website: http://www.iowahealthhomecare.org/body.cfm?id=42
My Aunt is 94 and living in an assisted living home, paying 1,000 a month, however, this facility she is at, DOES NOT, have all of the care that the Taylor House offers for care.
Investigate her needs, rather your parents and other Aunts/Uncles will need to do this, as they are her children. We grandchildren, unless caring for them personally, really have NO SAY in the situation at hand unless you have the backbone to stand up for your grandmother =] I wish you all the best, and hope this helped a little.
Jan
Please do like Ed said and don't wait. Family confrontations are always awful, money makes people nuts and morphine over an extended period of time with anybody, but especially the elderly, will turn them into a shadow of themselves which is what the thief and liar want.
This is ugly and you can fix it, but like many have said, you're going to need a lawyer and pronto.
Call the state's Attorney General. They take a dim view of any abuse of the elderly, physical, emotional or financial.
Good luck and keep us posted. What low lifes.
lovbob
Medicaid gets all and turns around and pays the place she'll be staying. This is in Ks.
Tell the grandson to report the POA and that lounge lizard husband of hers to the authorities before it's too late and the $ is all gone ... and grandma has to move in with him. Hurry.
-- ED
Using an alias, call Taylor House to ask about their weekly rates / charges. But stroke them a little with "I've heard you're the best; blah, blah, blah." Also, see if you can schedule a tour of the facilities -- or send someone instead -- to see what you'd actually be paying for. If possible, get it in print. Then confront the FPA about the $6K a week.
There's something fishy going on. And if not, your Mom better be living in the lap of luxury for that kind of money.
Good luck my friend, and keep us posted.
-- ED